Re: Website Maintenance Agreements

Ivan,

I have stayed out of these contract debates, but on this I cannot remain
quiet. First, in defense, I just skimmed the original post and came up with
the same intent that Cynthia later spelled out.

There can be major problems even when it is completely lawyer covered, and
to imply otherwise is not fair.  The only contract I have had ANY trouble
with was prepared by their in-house council and checked by my lawyer before
executing.  It is an airtight contract, and protects my work fully, but
guess what ... it is looking about 50/50 that I will be able to act, even
though they have changed the rules mid-stream and have broken copyright and
failed to meet at least 3 very carefully spelled out clauses of the
contract. Why? Because the damned legal fees would supercede any
compensation I could expect. My lawyers are checking now on the last hope
... that we can make a case for them paying my legal fees ...without it
their in-house council will bury my with my little claim. And believe me, I
am not fooling around with some backwoods lawyer more comfortable in divorce
court. This is a major firm with 3 copyright and patent lawyers on board,
plus a commercial litigation division.

Further, are you actually saying that you believe a contract will solve
every variation that is possible in a Web development project? If so, I am
no lawyer, but I can tell you unequivocally, that is nonsense. You deal with
the paper end of this business, and we deal with the people. I put a lot of
time into building the terms of a contract. In fact, most of my clients
start with an MOU so that I am covered by a deposit and written intent to
move to a contract, since I invest so much time pre-contract.

And even with that diligence prior to entering an agreement, we are usually
about 2 days into a project before a new idea springs forth, or further
investigation causes a veer in direction. If I was to write in every change
that was made along the way, and use a lawyer as you suggest, my lawyer
would be doing fine ... I would be starving.

The reality of a Web development project that it is a living, breathing
process - if you are any good. In addition, we deal with clients and that is
a relationship. We cannot stop a conversation and say, wait, that is not in
the contract. We listen, suggest, let them know that this or that would be
additional charges, etc. To refuse to discuss it, which would be keeping
with the original contract, would be suicidal customer service. I depend
heavily on my clients to help me make the site the best it can be. They are
an essential part of the process, and that cannot ever be put into a
contract.

I remember discussions like this when I was first starting out and they were
seriously intimidating. And for a while, I listened too well and became
somewhat arrogant - there is a line between professional protection and
arrogance, and I crossed it - for a very short time because it did not fit
well. I think that posts like this past one, that imply that the only reason
there could be any trouble (and in this case there was no trouble - just a
request for information) is that the contract is not tight enough,  are
totally unfair. You can do damage to those who are trying to find the right
way by making statements that. While it is hard to dispute the "rightness"
of the statement, the words do not reflect the reality of the world in which
we work. You stated that the "trouble" was the original contract was not
good enough.

Well, here goes my bare face, and I do not care who thinks I am incompetent
or uninformed. I do not do maintenance contracts with my development
contracts, ever. There is a clause that I will offer it at X dollars, but no
guarantee I will do it. Why? Reality again. I have had clients that you
could not pay me enough to make a regular part of my life, steady income be
damned. That is the reality of this business and as an intelligent,
thinking, professional woman, I am perfectly capable of determining what
works for me.

I have no problem with your posts on this list. I would prefer that you did
contribute real information from time to time, but as a marketer, I say ...
hey, it is no doubt time well spent for you and I do not find it offensive
in the least. However, I  also have to say that I am very glad people
dispute what you say, because you are not speaking from experience on the
development front lines (sorry I make a leap on that one, but your posts
indicate that to me). I think that is a serious consideration when
information presented on a list where we are here for the express purpose of
helping and being helped from an industry experience basis.

Wendy

New Tutorial 07/01: Gradients and Blends for Illustrator and Freehand
with Wendy Peck at http://productiongraphics.com

Wendy Peck http://wpeck.com
Marketing solutions through technology

----- Original Message -----
From: Ivan Hoffman <ivan(at)ivanhoffman.com>
To: Cynthia Hamilton <subscribe(at)actionhost.net>; <hwg-business(at)hwg.org>
Sent: Friday, July 07, 2000 12:40 PM
Subject: RE: Website Maintenance Agreements


At 09:38 AM 7/7/00 -0700, Cynthia Hamilton wrote:
>Ivan - you misread my post. (Not a good sign coming from an attorney trying
>to get business off this list.)

No need for sarcasm.  If I misread your post, perhaps it was because the
post was not clear.  It struck me and still strikes me that you have failed
to cover extra work in your agreement and that may be because you have
failed to adequately define the site and what is covered by the price.

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